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Sunday, July 24, 2016


The irony, it burns! "Modern conservatism is one long attempt to gain the approval of people who despise you at the expense of people most likely to befriend you."

That's gotta sting "It took me a while to realize that sometimes the proper response to an ally saying something outrageous, or offensive, or event racist is not "DENOUNCE, OSTRACIZE, SACRIFICE" but, 'Yeah, I think they're wrong on this. So fucking what?'"


Nate Winchester said...

Excellent catch.

Ilíon said...

Honestly, it doesn't take all that much work on my part to keep reminding him that he owes me an admission and an apology.

Nate Winchester said...

Can I submit one?

"he is one of the many conservative fools who thinks 61 million post-1965 immigrants were transformed into Real Americans through the application of Magic Dirt"

"when the time came to choose between America and his imaginary proposition nation,"

Bonus round!

"Through your open opposition to America's nationalists, you have revealed that your motives and your objectives are, at the very least, opposed to the interests of Americans and the United States of America."

But you know, if there's no magic dirt, and there's no proposition, then what "America" is there to betray? Is he next going to be called out for betraying Gondor or Narnia while we're talking about fictional nations? ;)

Ilíon said...

The "proposition nation" people whom VD castigates err in one extreme direction ... and so, in recompense, he errs in another extreme direction. But both are wrong; but VD is even more wrong, for he asserts that membership in the American nation is about, and only about, biology.

America *is* a "proposition nation", but it is not *just* a "proposition nation". America *is* a people, but it is not *just* a people -- and, as importantly, that people is defined by culture, not strictly, or even primarily, by biological descent.

"But you know, if there's no magic dirt, and there's no proposition, then what "America" is there to betray?"

Persons of English descent; for, as he has asserted time and again, only people with English genes can really be Americans, for what makes America itself is rooted in the particular history of England and the English.

Most of my white ancestors have been on this continent since before the Revolution, and most of them are from the British Isles, but more Welsh and Scots-Irish than English (my surname is probably English, though). But I also have a significant number of red ancestors, coming from three of my four grandparents. And Germans, and probably even Irish (I mean, separate from the Scots-Irish). And, *gasp* there are even some of (((those people))) amongst my ancestors. So, according to VD's ideology, I am not, and cannot be, really an American, despite that my ancestors have been part of this culture for close to 400 years.

But then, according to VD's ideology, neither can he. For by his own mouth, he fails the biology test; which makes it even more amusing that his "real America" followers have contracted out their thinking to a non-American.

Nate Winchester said...

As far as I know very few "propositional people" err in that extreme of a direction, but rather it's usually the usual rhetoric trick by their opponents to remove the complexities of the idea to simplify it into something objectionable. Such is modern discourse and depressing it is.

Anyway the fun of it is running out his logic. If English descent makes American, then that would mean it's England being betrayed. Otherwise it's "magic dirt" that's transforming Englishmen into Americans when they cross the pond.

Ilíon said...

"Anyway the fun of it is running out his logic."

Yeppers. A Mexican/Aztec telling Italians, Irish, Swedes, Germans, etc what it means to be part of the American nation ... when one of the main planks of that "what" is that you have to be English to really be American.